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Post by bigw1966 on Jan 10, 2011 12:21:24 GMT -5
OK guys,
Since the 50 greatest covers of 2010 thread seems pretty popular, and the subject of quality covers and what we each consider a "GOOD" cover to be is a solid topic around here, I thought I would start a thread where we could explore the subject in detail.
Yes, we will disagree from time to time, but that is because art is subjective. With that bit in mind, I am going to set a few ground rules for this thread.
1.) Comic cover can be from any genre and any era of comics.
2.)you must explain what it is about the cover you have posted makes it a good cover in your view. Is it the art? The composition? The quality of the color or painting work? Does it tell enough of a story to entice you to pick up an unknown title? Is the cover going for a direct reflection of the story at hand or is it more abstract and dealing with the overall feel of the story or just providing a common illustration styled image?
3.) It is uneccessary to quote an entire post including the image, that just makes the thread out of control. so, lets just respond to the post or quote the part of the description that we wish to address. (yes I know that that is petty but it sucks having to change pages 3 times just to find the next "NEW" post, so sue me. ;D
4.) Only do a single cover per new post. That way we can focus any responses.
5.) Have fun.
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Post by bigw1966 on Jan 10, 2011 12:29:18 GMT -5
MICRONAUTS Vol. 1, Issue 2. Artist; Michael Golden This has always been one of my favorite covers, I always thought the idea was rediculous because the danger shown is coming from a push mower. But, It is a perfectly acceptable danger for the diminutive stars of the book. I like how Golden composed the piece also, The man is sillouhetted into the background so that the main focus remains on the Micronauts and the mower. Also, the way that the layout is done, the person pushing the mower has his arms in such a position and also visible seperately from the figure in such a way that they help move the viewers eyes downward to where the action is making a really nice composition. The cover tells a basic story of the main characters fleeing danger from an unlikely source, and the tension on the characters faces helps sell the danger. It was this cover that made me a fan of Michael Golden, who I consider one of the best cover artists in the industry.
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Post by G on Jan 10, 2011 23:13:04 GMT -5
I've always dug that cover. The only problem with it today would be it looks a bit dated, but otherwise, it's my kind of cover. It has the elements I want in a cover. It shows the artist had to think about a scene to make you want to open the book. You could blur your eyes and today you would see these characters just fan out. This is a lot more compelling to me than to just come fanning out at me. This shows the Micronauts in a dire situation. One I might want to actually check out.
I remember the Micronauts back in those days. I remember I never really had any because I wasn't much into toys like this. But I also remember these were the shit when they came out. I just couldn't afford to spend my dough on building a collection of these. I think even back in the late 70's, these were like $5.95 a character. I had friends who had dozens of them. This comic captures the feeling you got when you seen the Micronauts. This cover not only helped sell the comic, it helped sell the toys.
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Post by G on Jan 10, 2011 23:50:08 GMT -5
I've often said that whatever period you start collecting comics probably plays a big role in what type of comics you end up liking. Unfortunately, I think that is why I am so disappointed today. Because I think a lot of collectors came from the booming early 90s era which saw insight covers start fading away and pose covers started becoming all the rage. Those appear to be the same people who lead the books today and why so many fanboys from today eat the shit up I hate so much. Because it still appeals to what they grew up on. Poster Shots and Poses which don't say a damn thing but they say....that rocks. Well take note of what I grew up on. X-Men #110 represents the first comic book I ever went out and purchased. Yes, before then I borrowed some comics off of friends and read them. I dug comics before I ever bought my first one. But I still remember exactly how I decided I was going to buy one way back in January 1978. I had always collecting things, like football and baseball cards. And tried various hobbies like models, balsawood airplanes and even some subscriptions to magazines. But I never went out and purchased a comic. At the ripe age of 10 going on 11. I decided to do just that. I went up to the local 7-11. (The one I would meet bigw at approximately a few years later). And I remember thinking I would walk in and just every comic would make me want it. Well. It didn't exactly happen that way. In fact. I was getting disappointed as I looked at the covers. I wanted something to reach out and say "buy me". I literally stood in front of the comics for about a half hour reading all the covers (yes, you could actually spend a LONG time actually reading covers....a treat I MISS BADLY TILL THIS DAY). Maybe I felt a bit intimidated by the covers because I didn't know which one to take a chance on. I didn't exactly know what was what. Yeah I knew the big names, but I didn't know which one I wanted to dive into. Just about the time I was getting discouraged, X-Men #110 caught my eye. First off all, I always dug the logo and it alone was eye catching. But second of all, look at all the shit going on on this cover?!!! Third, it gave me a reason to check out what was inside. This dude Warhawk was saying he was going to kill the X-Men with their own Danger Room. Shit, I had to check this shit out! Look at all the action on that cover?!!! Each X-Man had their own danger lurking. This looked exciting! I was sold instantly! I went home and read that comic about 5 times straight. I was back at the 7-11 THAT DAY and I was picking up more comics. I remember my 2nd comic was Machine Man #1. How powerful was that X-Men #110 comic? Not only did it compel me to buy that one comic. It was powerful enough to make me want to collect for the next 33 years! I hardly ever see a comic today that compels me to buy a 2nd issue. Back then a comic could sell itself to me just because it had something to say and something for you to check out. I never get this feeling hardly ever anymore. This to me is what is the endorphin feeling I try and get every time I look for a comic.
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Post by cyberstrike on Jan 11, 2011 10:50:45 GMT -5
I think the problem with most artists and maybe publishers too is that they want all their books to have iconic covers similar to the famous ones from the Golden and the Silver Ages. The problem is that while the covers to books like Action Comics #1, Detective Comics #27, The Fantastic Four #1, Amazing Fantasy #15 and others like them are indeed iconic, even in the Golden Ages and Silver Ages not every cover was going to be an iconic cover in fact most covers from the Golden and Silver Ages are like 99.9% of today's covers: forgettable.
I agree that the pose shots and lifeless covers that flood the market today suck, but even if they were doing covers that would be telling what the story was about in the style of Silver Age chances are I still wouldn't buy a new issue of say The Uncanny X-Men for example because I just don't care for the book right now and no matter who draws the cover or who or what is on the cover I'm not buying a book I don't care about.
The cover is probably the least important thing to me (because in this day of endless variants 99.9% of all them all look the same anyway) when I buy a book. I'll take a great book with great story and art over a book with a shitty cover over a book a great cover and shitty story and art.
Because no cover is not going to hide a shitty story and crappy art on the inside.
Can covers be used as a selling point? Yes, they always have and always will (at least in print) but they are only one thing to sell a book not the only thing.
I think because vast majority of what both Marvel and DC put out is crap advertising the crap on the covers would drive their sells in further in the ditch.
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Post by defiant1 on Jan 11, 2011 13:28:08 GMT -5
I think the problem with most artists and maybe publishers too is that they want all their books to have iconic covers similar to the famous ones from the Golden and the Silver Ages. The problem is that while the covers to books like Action Comics #1, Detective Comics #27, The Fantastic Four #1, Amazing Fantasy #15 and others like them are indeed iconic, even in the Golden Ages and Silver Ages not every cover was going to be an iconic cover in fact most covers from the Golden and Silver Ages are like 99.9% of today's covers: forgettable. I agree that the pose shots and lifeless covers that flood the market today suck, but even if they were doing covers that would be telling what the story was about in the style of Silver Age chances are I still wouldn't buy a new issue of say The Uncanny X-Men for example because I just don't care for the book right now and no matter who draws the cover or who or what is on the cover I'm not buying a book I don't care about. The cover is probably the least important thing to me (because in this day of endless variants 99.9% of all them all look the same anyway) when I buy a book. I'll take a great book with great story and art over a book with a shitty cover over a book a great cover and shitty story and art. Because no cover is not going to hide a shitty story and crappy art on the inside. Can covers be used as a selling point? Yes, they always have and always will (at least in print) but they are only one thing to sell a book not the only thing. I think because vast majority of what both Marvel and DC put out is crap advertising the crap on the covers would drive their sells in further in the ditch. You would be amazed at how much a well designed and informative cover can actually plot out a series. I used to scribble out fake covers to summarize what a fictitious comic was going to include inside and it inspired my friends to beg me into drawing a comic. Everyone has become desensitized to the modern covers because they are so uninformative. 60's DC comics may have had a lot of campy crap on them, but who wasn't curious about what was going on inside after looking at them. The Micronauts cover with the push mower evokes thought and it defines aspects of the characters that may not be evident at first. You immediately know that the characters are very small in relationship to the rest of the world. You know some can fly. You have a pretty good idea that something is happening. I'm reminded of a Silver Surfer series that had very little story about the Silver Surfer and was really a complete rip off after i bought it. Forcing there to be a relevant cover can actually challenge a writer to write a relevant story. DC knew that putting a gorilla on the cover increased sales so they delivered a story that met what the readers wanted. Again, most of that stuff was campy, but it doesn't have to be. df1
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Post by bigw1966 on Jan 11, 2011 15:23:57 GMT -5
My collecting goes even further back than "G" I was obsessed with Spider-Man by the age of 4 because of the old Marvel cartoon. The first Spidet comic that I remember having was this one right here with the tagline "Spidey Cops Out" Its likely that I had a couple of them before this, but this one always stuck in my head because spidey quit. I like how the cover has spidey larger than the crowd so he is basically seperated from it, and how the crowd is in a fury. Spidey always had the best covers on comics at the time to me. Also, Golden Age covers were primarily very similar to what you see here. They only had a couple of pose type covers for every hundred books or so. The rest were all action covers.
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Post by G on Jan 11, 2011 23:52:41 GMT -5
I agree that the pose shots and lifeless covers that flood the market today suck, but even if they were doing covers that would be telling what the story was about in the style of Silver Age chances are I still wouldn't buy a new issue of say The Uncanny X-Men for example because I just don't care for the book right now and no matter who draws the cover or who or what is on the cover I'm not buying a book I don't care about. The cover is probably the least important thing to me (because in this day of endless variants 99.9% of all them all look the same anyway) when I buy a book. I'll take a great book with great story and art over a book with a shitty cover over a book a great cover and shitty story and art. Because no cover is not going to hide a shitty story and crappy art on the inside. Well, I certainly agree with all that. I'm also not going to buy a book I can't stand just because I rather like the cover. In terms of importance, I agree it's the least important out of Story, Art and Cover. But just like Football has Offense, Defense and Special Teams, you aren't going to have championship caliber teams that don't excel at great special teams. That forgotten aspect can be worth 2 or 3 wins in a season. Covers are like Special Teams. If you know the books sucks, the cover ain't gonna matter. But what about the tons of books you don't really know anything about? If you don't know anything about them are we going to be moved by a poster shot or pose? Maybe. But I think I personally would be quicker moved by a cover with a bit of insight or appeal in making me believe it had something to offer. I think I might be attracted a bit more to a cover that is trying to sell itself to me, rather than one that just gives me another pose or poster shot like the rest of the shelf. I think because vast majority of what both Marvel and DC put out is crap advertising the crap on the covers would drive their sells in further in the ditch. I've been buying monthly from DCBS ever since I started working again. And I was when I worked my previous job too. Every month I order the Previews because it is on $1.12 and it comes with a free Marvel Previews too. Before I sit down and do my monthly order, I ofter spend a decent amount of time thumbing through the pages of Previews. I can't tell you what a dreadful experience that can be when pretty much 90% of them are offering the same kind of bullshit covers. I literally have to read the overly slanted write ups about the books that almost always use phrases like.... "Will alter the course of the history" "Like you've never seen before" "You never seen the likes of this before" "By legendary creators" "You won't believe your eyes" These write-ups are so full of shit that often the only thing I have to go on is experience, reputation and plain old gut feelings. Books and creators I know about, I go in with a lot more confidence. But honestly the ones I want on a continual basis are so few that I find myself taking chances on books and creators I know little to nothing about. Unfortunately, the covers shots are not separating themselves from the rest of the pack either. Almost all of them giving me the same staredown, poses and fan-outs. I often wonder how sales are as good as they are when the books main focus on the cover, the one big selling point they have, is just posing in front of me. That cover is prime advertising real estate that I don't think is used to full potential. I literally ask those covers to sell themselves to me and so very few of them ever do.
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Post by G on Jan 11, 2011 23:56:58 GMT -5
My collecting goes even further back than "G" I was obsessed with Spider-Man by the age of 4 because of the old Marvel cartoon. The first Spidet comic that I remember having was this one right here with the tagline "Spidey Cops Out" Its likely that I had a couple of them before this, but this one always stuck in my head because spidey quit. I like how the cover has spidey larger than the crowd so he is basically seperated from it, and how the crowd is in a fury. Spidey always had the best covers on comics at the time to me. Also, Golden Age covers were primarily very similar to what you see here. They only had a couple of pose type covers for every hundred books or so. The rest were all action covers. I would be attracted to a book like this no problem. I agree with Bronze Spider-mans having some great covers. Just think how a book like this would be represented today. This cover stuck with you because Spidey quit, was larger and separated from the angry crowd. It gave you a reason to want to check it out. Today that same book would sport a cover with Spider-man swinging on his web coming at you. I would literally have no idea what to expect in the interior. That's honestly how I feel I'm being treated today.
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Post by G on Jan 15, 2011 12:53:04 GMT -5
Here's a great example of a cover selling itself to the potential customer. How could you not wonder what was going on in this comic when it hit the stands? I remember this came out when I was about 13 or so and me and my friends just laughed at some of the scenes inside. Sure, battling alcoholism isn't heroic at all. But this cover made heroes seem a bit more regular human with emotional problems like the rest of us. It was hard to look at this cover and turn away. You put a regular Iron Man flying around cover on this and this book doesn't have half the impact. It's the cover that turned this one into an instant classic.
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