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Post by G on May 10, 2012 6:35:25 GMT -5
I was talking to a good friend of mine last night and we got into a discussion about her daughter being into Manga/Anime drawings. She indicated that her daughter draws a lot of Manga style. I also had some other girl I know texting me messages and showing me pictures that her niece drew, once again Manga style. While the pictures were good, the simplification of the Manga faces distracted me and to me showed the real lack of talent.
I replied to both that its great both of them have been introduced to art by the influence of Manga but I feel like Manga is a crutch that simplifies drawing and is usually meant for those who either cant draw and its easy to learn or those who can but are too lazy to progress. I encouraged both to try and get these individuals away from drawing Manga style and drawing for real and their art will improve more because of it.
Then the one friend whos daughter is 13 started being concerned because her daughter is into Furries and her daughter wanted to be one.
I replied that Manga has a dark side. It usually gets their interest as they are young with such titles such as Pokeman and Yu-gi-oh. But it quickly spreads from there. I told this one, and this is just me personally, but I told this one woman that I feel like Manga is the lowest form of child porn. She seemed a little stunned by this and asked why I felt this way? I replied because all the characters have 6 year old faces with bodies that are 21. And as you progress into Manga, it get more and more provocative. I said I would be less disturbed if it had adult faces and adult bodies but more often than not, the faces appear to be that of a small child and that has always disturbed me.
I further mentioned at comic conventions often time you have teens and young adults getting into cosplay and I believe this furries fetish is a slice of that. I pined that when I go to conventions its nothing to see social rejects trolling around the show in their costumes and often they smell and have half their body parts hanging out. Later you usually see a side room of 50 year old guys taking pictures as these costume players roll around on the floor in sexual positions or daring superhero poses. But typically for the nerds taking the pictures its a form of titillation for them. I said this furry stuff her daughter was into was probably an introduction to a lifestyle that borders on depravity and should be of concern.
How do you guys feel? Do you agree that Manga has a negative influence on both art and social areas, or do you feel its purely harmless and Im the one with the problem? I'm curious to see what others think.
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Post by cyberstrike on May 10, 2012 12:39:03 GMT -5
I think this is the most disgusting post you ever posted.
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Post by G on May 10, 2012 14:04:28 GMT -5
I think this is the most disgusting post you ever posted. So you're saying you don't agree with it. Which is fine. I'm just checking. |
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Post by cyberstrike on May 10, 2012 18:15:24 GMT -5
I think this is the most disgusting post you ever posted. So you're saying you don't agree with it. Which is fine. I'm just checking. You damn right I 1000% disagree with it. I almost feels like it's a personal insult about me.  |
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Post by G on May 10, 2012 18:34:45 GMT -5
So you're saying you don't agree with it. Which is fine. I'm just checking. You damn right I 1000% disagree with it. I almost feels like it's a personal insult about me. Come on cyber! It had NOTHING to do with you. Absolutely NOTHING!!! Did you see the message about I spoke to 2 women who had either a child or a relative drawing Manga and one was getting into being a Furry? Artistically I was saying that Manga is a style that to me, seems to lend itself to simplicity in drawing. When MOST the artists draw a face the same way. Its almost like an A,B,C type of drawing. If you can draw triangles and diamonds, and half circles, you can learn to draw manga faces. So artistically I was saying it becomes a crutch style for aspiring artists to draw with. Are there some great ones?  Sure. Just like any profession. But I believe the majority of people who draw in a Manga style draw so similar that you can hardly tell one from another. So artistically, I think it stunts growth. The other point I was trying to make is I think it does start off innocent in most cases. But it has always disturbed me personally that Manga has children faces with adult bodies. Now there is plenty drawn innocently enough but Im sure me and you have both seen Manga pictures of girls showing off panties and stuff on an adult body and the face looks 6 years old. To me, its borderline child pornography. Lets just say that it probably appeals to pedophiles if you ask me. At least SOME of it does. Not all of it. But some of it looks like child porn to me. Top it off, I do see a lot of cosplay at conventions or pictures of cosplay and a lot of it is Anime come to life and we get little sailor girl type of outfits on girls or even grown women and the draw is to look slutty in public while hiding behind the mask of saying its a costume. I think the Furry stuff is a lighter form of this and starts off as cute and cuddly animals people want to dress up as, but the next step after that or as you get older may be to branch over to cosplay and be seen looking like a slut in public. Not saying they all do it, but come on. I even see non-cosplay chicks at conventions dressing up as American superheroes and we see plenty of T&A in these outfits. So my thought was Manga/Anime may lead to Furries which may lead to Cosplay. It certainly doesnt go that route for all and maybe it doesnt go that route for a lot. But I think there is a dark side of Manga and the further one gets drawn into it, the more they become exposed into these other sides. So, this has NOTHING to do with you Cyber! Nothing at all! In fact, I had no idea you were even into Manga except if you want to consider the Transformers Manga which I would agree is an offshoot of it but I don't think it is as far as traditional human characterization is concerned. Honestly, when I posted this. I didnt have a SINGLE thought about you. I posted it because I have been presented drawings from aspiring young folks who appear to show a bit of talent and we have the pointed faces and eyes of Manga and it shows a confining of progress in my eyes. I made a plea to try and sway these individuals to draw something besides Manga to challenge themselves. I appreciate Manga got these individuals into drawing but for the sake of progression, I would recommend to get away from drawing Manga style and learn to become a true artist. There is no personal attack here and I would like to see replies that have no personal reference either. I would instead rather see the insights on what others think about the topic itself. |
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Post by defiant1 on May 10, 2012 22:27:24 GMT -5
I don't care for Manga unless the artist is extremely talented. Pokemon and Yugi-"ho" is of course a starter set of cards to initiate kids into devil worship. How else is Satan going to reach kids except through things like that or idiotic purple dinosaurs?
Unfortunately, I can't insult Manga as I would prefer. The girl I date loves it and she's intelligent and flat out perfect. Anything negative that I once thought is likely wrong now that I've discovered she likes it.
If you want to collect Manga at it's finest, you need to search out the series "Bondage Fairies". It is extremely funny. It is extremely well drawn. It features sexy little drawing of fairies having sex with insects and small animals. I wouldn't sell a first printing of the first series for less than $75 in any condition (well...VG or better). The later series aren't as hard to find.
df1
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Post by cyberstrike on May 15, 2012 13:03:43 GMT -5
You damn right I 1000% disagree with it. I almost feels like it's a personal insult about me. Come on cyber! It had NOTHING to do with you. Absolutely NOTHING!!! Did you see the message about I spoke to 2 women who had either a child or a relative drawing Manga and one was getting into being a Furry? Artistically I was saying that Manga is a style that to me, seems to lend itself to simplicity in drawing. When MOST the artists draw a face the same way. Its almost like an A,B,C type of drawing. If you can draw triangles and diamonds, and half circles, you can learn to draw manga faces. So artistically I was saying it becomes a crutch style for aspiring artists to draw with. Are there some great ones? Sure. Just like any profession. But I believe the majority of people who draw in a Manga style draw so similar that you can hardly tell one from another. So artistically, I think it stunts growth. The other point I was trying to make is I think it does start off innocent in most cases. But it has always disturbed me personally that Manga has children faces with adult bodies. Now there is plenty drawn innocently enough but Im sure me and you have both seen Manga pictures of girls showing off panties and stuff on an adult body and the face looks 6 years old. To me, its borderline child pornography. Lets just say that it probably appeals to pedophiles if you ask me. At least SOME of it does. Not all of it. But some of it looks like child porn to me. There are adult manga called henti (aka porn) and it's no different than any porn comic in the West. Some of the characters do look underage, but I never seen a manga where it's shown to be a child. If you see one call the cops and/or the FBI. That's funny because of most pictures of the cosplayers I've seen are based on Western characters and properties like Mass Effect, Halo, Stargate, Star Wars, Star Trek, Spider-Man, Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman, X-Men, and more. Sure they are anime cosplayers but every picture from SDCC in past 10 years I've seen more Western characters than anime/manga characters. I think you're basing this crap on an episode of CSI. Some people are turned by their partners licking their feet, others by dressing up (and come on lets admit it we've all have fantasies about fucking some character from a comic/video game/movie I know I have) as long as don't rape others or hurt underage children I could care less who fucks who and how. Cosplayers are some of the most creative fans around especially the ones who take time and care into their costumes. They can be annoying but most the part they're harmless. Actually there is several Transformers manga. I haven't read it because it's not available in English other than fan translations. I grew up in the 80/90s and a lot of my childhood is tied up to anime, I grew up watching Robotech, Voltron, Gundam, Akria, Ghost in the Shell, Ninja Scroll, Macross II, Macross Plus, Pokemon, and more. Hell even the orginal 80s G.I. Joe: A Real American Hero and The Transformers have anime elements (and even full-fledged anime series), but so does Batman: The Animated Series, Superman: The Animated Series, Batman Beyond, Justice League, and Justice League Unlimited. I've read a lot of great manga like Akria, Ghost in the Shell, Gon, Domu, The Legend of Mother Sarah, Gundam Wing, and yes I even read a few issues of Pokemon. I was watching an anime show called Robotech which is FAR better than just about any live action sci-fi TV show out today, when you posted this nonsense. I just did. |
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Post by G on May 15, 2012 21:10:51 GMT -5
Come on cyber! It had NOTHING to do with you. Absolutely NOTHING!!! Did you see the message about I spoke to 2 women who had either a child or a relative drawing Manga and one was getting into being a Furry? Artistically I was saying that Manga is a style that to me, seems to lend itself to simplicity in drawing. When MOST the artists draw a face the same way. Its almost like an A,B,C type of drawing. If you can draw triangles and diamonds, and half circles, you can learn to draw manga faces. So artistically I was saying it becomes a crutch style for aspiring artists to draw with. Are there some great ones? Sure. Just like any profession. But I believe the majority of people who draw in a Manga style draw so similar that you can hardly tell one from another. So artistically, I think it stunts growth. The other point I was trying to make is I think it does start off innocent in most cases. But it has always disturbed me personally that Manga has children faces with adult bodies. Now there is plenty drawn innocently enough but Im sure me and you have both seen Manga pictures of girls showing off panties and stuff on an adult body and the face looks 6 years old. To me, its borderline child pornography. Lets just say that it probably appeals to pedophiles if you ask me. At least SOME of it does. Not all of it. But some of it looks like child porn to me. There are adult manga called henti (aka porn) and it's no different than any porn comic in the West. Some of the characters do look underage, but I never seen a manga where it's shown to be a child. If you see one call the cops and/or the FBI. I'm not saying the Manga characters are depicting them as children. I'm saying they are presenting ADULTS as though they are children. Maybe this is the way out of it. Maybe you can draw a character that looks 6 years old in the face but has the tits, ass, hips, waists and legs of a 22 year old woman. If you complain that she looks like a little girl, the easy comeback is....She's a 22 year old woman. Yeah, with the face of a little girl! That's funny because of most pictures of the cosplayers I've seen are based on Western characters and properties like Mass Effect, Halo, Stargate, Star Wars, Star Trek, Spider-Man, Batman, Superman, Wonder Woman, X-Men, and more. Sure they are anime cosplayers but every picture from SDCC in past 10 years I've seen more Western characters than anime/manga characters. I think you're basing this crap on an episode of CSI. Some people are turned by their partners licking their feet, others by dressing up (and come on lets admit it we've all have fantasies about fucking some character from a comic/video game/movie I know I have) as long as don't rape others or hurt underage children I could care less who fucks who and how. Cosplayers are some of the most creative fans around especially the ones who take time and care into their costumes. They can be annoying but most the part they're harmless. Look, Im not saying that everyone that puts on a costume and goes to a convention is doing nothing but Manga and/or is prancing around as a slut in a costume. But Ive been to too many shows where putting on a costume means I don't have to care about the little 5-12 year old children walking around at the show either. Hey, I'm Elecktra (Yes, a Western Character). I have a red outfit on with big slits up the side of my legs....Whoops....I forgot to wear my panties?!!! Oh my!!! This cosplay stuff doesnt stay just with Manga/Anime. And I'll admit that. But I have seen tons of Sailor Girls and Manga Pixies prancing around in GoGo boots and skin tight or showing outfits like the laws of decency don't apply to them. The cosplay is not strictly related Manga, but in general, the word cosplay conjurers up images of Japanese teenagers and young adults prancing around in costumes and often sexy. In fact doing a search on the word cosplay brings up more Manga/Anime related costume pictures than not.... See for yourself....This is the word cosplay on Google Images... www.google.com/search?hl=en&tok=ZBrUVif1-JWm-mPb5OcTGA&cp=4&gs_id=a1&xhr=t&q=cosplay&biw=1920&bih=887&bav=on.2,or.r_gc.r_pw.r_qf.,cf.osb&um=1&ie=UTF-8&tbm=isch&source=og&sa=N&tab=wi&ei=TgizT-_FHOXx6QG6sOCLCQ Actually there is several Transformers manga. I haven't read it because it's not available in English other than fan translations. I grew up in the 80/90s and a lot of my childhood is tied up to anime, I grew up watching Robotech, Voltron, Gundam, Akria, Ghost in the Shell, Ninja Scroll, Macross II, Macross Plus, Pokemon, and more. Hell even the orginal 80s G.I. Joe: A Real American Hero and The Transformers have anime elements (and even full-fledged anime series), but so does Batman: The Animated Series, Superman: The Animated Series, Batman Beyond, Justice League, and Justice League Unlimited. I've read a lot of great manga like Akria, Ghost in the Shell, Gon, Domu, The Legend of Mother Sarah, Gundam Wing, and yes I even read a few issues of Pokemon. I was watching an anime show called Robotech which is FAR better than just about any live action sci-fi TV show out today, when you posted this nonsense. I grew up in the same type of era. Star Rangers and G-Force was huge when I was a kid. I watched a lot of it myself. It was innocent. A lot of it is innocent. But I don't think its right to say there isn't a seedy side to it. It'll go as far as anyone lets it go and wants it to go. The concern my friend had was her daughter was transferring from innocent Manga comics to Furries. So now she wants to dress up as an animal and hang around others who are dressed up as animals. Okay, shes 13. Guess what. There are adults dressed up the same way. What's next? Well, not saying she gets to this but cosplay may come into play in the next 3-4 years. She is already influenced by what she is seeing and she wants to be a part of it. She may never get to that point but as she gets older, she may do exactly that. Yes, its the same with Western stuff too. But just like I can't deny there is an ugly side to American cartoons and so on, neither can we deny there isnt one with Manga/Anime. It goes as far as people let themselves get. The question I had does Manga/Anime have that kind of influence? I personally think it does. Your previous response said you were watching a Sci-TV show when I posted this nonsense. I think that is a bit of a personal comment. Now, Im not going to get bent out of shape over it because I like how you took the time to answer the question on this last post the way I wished for when I made the thread. I wanted to hear both sides of it both pros and cons. You obviously disagree with my thread and my viewpoints and I respect that. And I appreciate your comments to the contrary. Those kind of comments are totally welcome here. I have to say as the Admin of this board its almost my responsibility to post threads to make you want to respond in some kind of way. Often, my responses would seem too vanilla for people to find the will to want to respond. This doesnt do me much good. Im glad you felt compelled to respond. Thats my only objective. I like seeing you post your position without attacking who I am and I will try and return the same. I leave on one last note. I made another point that Manga seems to stunt growth. I havent seen you respond to that aspect of it. Only that it seems offensive that I paint Manga in a lewd light. I want to reiterate that I dont feel this way about all Manga/Anime. A lot of it is totally fine and I dont have one concern with it and its healthy entertainment for all. But I also think some of it makes for questionable fodder for young kids. Some can be said for American comics. But this thread wasn't about American comics and that affect. I invite you to post a message about that if you desire. But in this case, the comment was about Manga/Anime and its potential for bad habits. |
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Sure. Just like any profession. But I believe the majority of people who draw in a Manga style draw so similar that you can hardly tell one from another. So artistically, I think it stunts growth. 
