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Post by G on Aug 14, 2010 8:35:02 GMT -5
G, I thought you were going to review Magnus #1. Solar has been out awhile. The artist on Solar #1 left out a lot of the elements in the script. He was swapped out after #2 was solicited. JayJay is now saying that closer to 27,000 issues of Solar came out. They squeezed some orders out at San Diego. Costs are associated with any promotions. Did the sales gained at San Diego justify the costs associated with going? Probably so, but it ate a chunk into any profits. df1 Yeah I know, being I order comics through DCBS, I only get them once a month. Usually its not too timely. Books I receive are sometimes books that have been out awhile. Sometimes I learn before I receive my books whether I should have ordered it or not. Sometimes I find out I wish I had ordered other books. I reviewed Solar #1 because it was the one I had and it was the one we were talking about the sales numbers. After reading the book, I think the sales numbers match the book's effort. If Dark Horse would have promoted this book more, I think there would have just been more disappointed customers. I really think the artist was a very poor match. I hope the new artist breaths some life into the character. No more half assed efforts on what should be a top notch launch. I had a much better time reading Thor than this.
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Post by cyberstrike on Aug 14, 2010 13:47:48 GMT -5
Barry Wisdor-Smith has the same problems with Dark Horse's marketing department on BWS: Storyteller, hell he told them: "YOU HAVE TO MARKET THIS BOOK!" and they didn't.
DH has the same problem as TNA Wrestling does in marketing their products TNA wants to be the competitor to WWE but instead of putting shows that shows the best of the present days and the future stars of wrestling instead they bury them for guys whose best days are behind them and play to nostalgia of the old WCW and ECW companies that have went of business.
I feel it's the same way with Dark Horse's GK revival it relies heavily on nostalgia for the original GK or the early Shooter Valiant. The problem is that nostalgia will only get you so far sure it's great for Shooter to be back writing comics again but that will only get so far, because a lot of people blame him (rightly or wrongly) for the demise of Valiant and the speculator burst. Instead of taking these characters forward with creators that could do something more interesting with them we're treated to a 90s style revival of 60s characters with a company that seems more intested in reprinting the 60s material and can't market itself out of paper bag, and a creator whose name has limited selling power to a small group of die hard fans.
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Post by G on Aug 14, 2010 20:23:34 GMT -5
Barry Wisdor-Smith has the same problems with Dark Horse's marketing department on BWS: Storyteller, hell he told them: "YOU HAVE TO MARKET THIS BOOK!" and they didn't. I feel it's the same way with Dark Horse's GK revival it relies heavily on nostalgia for the original GK or the early Shooter Valiant. The problem is that nostalgia will only get you so far sure it's great for Shooter to be back writing comics again but that will only get so far, because a lot of people blame him (rightly or wrongly) for the demise of Valiant and the speculator burst. Instead of taking these characters forward with creators that could do something more interesting with them we're treated to a 90s style revival of 60s characters with a company that seems more intested in reprinting the 60s material and can't market itself out of paper bag, and a creator whose name has limited selling power to a small group of die hard fans. I honestly wish that Shooter would work on stuff that is not Valiant related or even any kind of start up company, newly created universe or even an existing universe or stop being a savior to a nearly dead title. Shooter wasn't the savior to everything when he headed Valiant, he was just doing a great job at what he does. It seems since he has been morphed into "The Mighty Shooter" his fortunes have suffered. The man was mostly "Good Stuff" for the previous 10-15 years before that and his name didn't have all that extra weight. Even when he was EIC at Marvel he wasn't looked at like he is now. I'd just like to see him do consistent work. On just comics and everyone stop scrutinizing so much over him and wish the man would put out just some damn comics that aint associated so much with his disrespected legacy. Just create some good comics again Jim. Geez! The Valiant thing is also just as troubling if not more. It's like a moment in the past that won't "move on". It's like Valiant has to re-achieve the same greatness it had with Pre-Unity Valiant or no one will ever be satisfied again. It's almost like looking at Bryne/Claremont X-Men and being pissed that we can't keep reliving the Dark Phoenix saga. I'm so glad a title like that can move on and look for the next best thing and better days ahead. Valiant just seems so convoluted trying to make it work again. It's so much expectation and Dark Horse is proving to look like a bad host for them to continue on. A year ago, I had high hopes for this relaunch but as mentioned before the marketing was horrendous and so far the output looks disappointing. I feel like I've seen it all before only better and by different companies, titles and characters. I've been feeling this way for a long time now. I'm ready for the NEXT great thing in comics. I just don't think Valiant will ever be it again. They almost seem like they would be better if every Valiant character was a million miles apart from the other and maybe even run by a bunch of different companies. Each existing character owned by a different company. Any chance of them being collected again by one company as a group or minor group obliterated. The collective group has long since grown stale. I honestly like the one issue that VIP did the most of anything since Unity 2000. It looked nothing like we remembered with Valiant. It was at least a FRESH take on them. Almost wish they had won even though I know they wouldn't have worked either. At least it wasn't "Lets recreate the Valiant Bible!!!" Let's stick a fork in this already and find something good that's new. It's about time comics made another classic and leave this long behind. I'm long over Valiant. Hell, I'm enjoying Brightest Day better than this. Sorry to say, there really is better than this out there.
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Post by defiant1 on Aug 14, 2010 22:01:23 GMT -5
Barry Wisdor-Smith has the same problems with Dark Horse's marketing department on BWS: Storyteller, hell he told them: "YOU HAVE TO MARKET THIS BOOK!" and they didn't. DH has the same problem as TNA Wrestling does in marketing their products TNA wants to be the competitor to WWE but instead of putting shows that shows the best of the present days and the future stars of wrestling instead they bury them for guys whose best days are behind them and play to nostalgia of the old WCW and ECW companies that have went of business. I feel it's the same way with Dark Horse's GK revival it relies heavily on nostalgia for the original GK or the early Shooter Valiant. The problem is that nostalgia will only get you so far sure it's great for Shooter to be back writing comics again but that will only get so far, because a lot of people blame him (rightly or wrongly) for the demise of Valiant and the speculator burst. Instead of taking these characters forward with creators that could do something more interesting with them we're treated to a 90s style revival of 60s characters with a company that seems more interessted in reprinting the 60s material and can't market itself out of paper bag, and a creator whose name has limited selling power to a small group of die hard fans. Wow! I didn't remember BWS complaining about the marketing! At the time he published his complaints, I was more fascinated about his writers block and disgust emotionally. I dealt with that on my cartoon because of someone and I just felt it odd that I could relate to what he was saying so thoroughly. It seems like their idea of marketing is to hire a big name creator and exploit their reputation. You are correct. Nostalgia only goes so far. You have to market on multiple levels to reach the widest audience. What amazed me the most is that they had a twitter feed only promoting the stuff that was already out. Why would they wait until a book is already ordered to promote it? A twitter feed is essentially free! Have an office employee post two posts a day as a job requirement. Setup accounts for all the creators and require them to post something. I don't even think it's a horrible idea to toss in a few reprint pages into a new book to promote the hardcovers. If you do, don't make it half the book. Make it six pages or something. A teaser is better marketing than a full handout. In a hobby that revolves around the collectibility factor, why flood the market by introducing the launch on FCBD? You've guaranteed the comic will be worthless. You've also guaranteed that the book will be handed out to people who will never care and will never want it. I told Janet that I wouldn't be complaining if the problems I see weren't fixable. They can be fixed. The problem is now that you only have one opportunity to make a first impression. People who didn't like or get Solar #1 are already dissuaded from buying more. I'm not buying Magnus #1. I read the online preview and it seemed a tad bit childish. Robots were getting smashed and I just didn't care. Might doesn't make right. Show me why Magnus is a good character. The sex bimbo angle Jim throws into stories is always a little creepy to me. I like Jim's stories when they get intense. His early issues never are. The final straw for me is the price. Don't tack on an entire reprint comic that I don't want in order to justify charging me $3.50 All that does is prompt a haughty "fuck you" from my lips. df1
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Post by defiant1 on Aug 14, 2010 22:10:54 GMT -5
Let's stick a fork in this already and find something good that's new. It's about time comics made another classic and leave this long behind. I'm long over Valiant. Well... their screw up again is that they wanted Solar and Magnus to be their flagship titles. They should have used that as teasers. This relaunch did not have to be compared to Valiant. Starting with a Dr. Spektor or Mighty Samson would have given this universe it's own identity. df1
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Post by G on Aug 14, 2010 23:44:55 GMT -5
I'm not buying Magnus #1. I read the online preview and it seemed a tad bit childish. Robots were getting smashed and I just didn't care. Might doesn't make right. Show me why Magnus is a good character. The sex bimbo angle Jim throws into stories is always a little creepy to me. I like Jim's stories when they get intense. His early issues never are. I haven't been able to see any of Magnus #1 yet but one of the worst parts of Solar #1 to me was when the writer discovers his thoughts are coming to life and decides he wants to see if he can do it again. So instead of making another villain or person of power like before, he creates a sex bomb. Okay, I can understand that being a thought if you suddenly realize such a power, but then she turns out to be a drunken, smelly skank that he doesn't want to be near. I didn't see the point in it. Since the character still existed at the end of the issue are we supposed to end up caring about her in a later issue? Could this be Jim exposing a bit? His thoughts coming to life as his mind creators characters. Jim against his own characters while hanging with boozy broads? LOL! Just kidding....
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Post by G on Aug 14, 2010 23:48:44 GMT -5
Let's stick a fork in this already and find something good that's new. It's about time comics made another classic and leave this long behind. I'm long over Valiant. Well... their screw up again is that they wanted Solar and Magnus to be their flagship titles. They should have used that as teasers. This relaunch did not have to be compared to Valiant. Starting with a Dr. Spektor or Mighty Samson would have given this universe it's own identity. df1 Those characters do seem more appealing than Solar and Magnus at the moment.
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Post by defiant1 on Aug 15, 2010 1:11:30 GMT -5
I'm not buying Magnus #1. I read the online preview and it seemed a tad bit childish. Robots were getting smashed and I just didn't care. Might doesn't make right. Show me why Magnus is a good character. The sex bimbo angle Jim throws into stories is always a little creepy to me. I like Jim's stories when they get intense. His early issues never are. I haven't been able to see any of Magnus #1 yet but one of the worst parts of Solar #1 to me was when the writer discovers his thoughts are coming to life and decides he wants to see if he can do it again. So instead of making another villain or person of power like before, he creates a sex bomb. Okay, I can understand that being a thought if you suddenly realize such a power, but then she turns out to be a drunken, smelly skank that he doesn't want to be near. I didn't see the point in it. Since the character still existed at the end of the issue are we supposed to end up caring about her in a later issue? Could this be Jim exposing a bit? His thoughts coming to life as his mind creators characters. Jim against his own characters while hanging with boozy broads? LOL! Just kidding.... Unfortunately you have to read the interviews to understand what is going on. This has to do with the down side of having a super ability. The bad aspects can magnify also. I guess I've gotten so sick of Frank Miller's work appearing so misogynistic that I get tired in general of women not being portrayed with any respectable characteristics. df1
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Post by cyberstrike on Aug 15, 2010 11:41:02 GMT -5
Barry Wisdor-Smith has the same problems with Dark Horse's marketing department on BWS: Storyteller, hell he told them: "YOU HAVE TO MARKET THIS BOOK!" and they didn't. I feel it's the same way with Dark Horse's GK revival it relies heavily on nostalgia for the original GK or the early Shooter Valiant. The problem is that nostalgia will only get you so far sure it's great for Shooter to be back writing comics again but that will only get so far, because a lot of people blame him (rightly or wrongly) for the demise of Valiant and the speculator burst. Instead of taking these characters forward with creators that could do something more interesting with them we're treated to a 90s style revival of 60s characters with a company that seems more intested in reprinting the 60s material and can't market itself out of paper bag, and a creator whose name has limited selling power to a small group of die hard fans. I honestly wish that Shooter would work on stuff that is not Valiant related or even any kind of start up company, newly created universe or even an existing universe or stop being a savior to a nearly dead title. Shooter wasn't the savior to everything when he headed Valiant, he was just doing a great job at what he does. It seems since he has been morphed into "The Mighty Shooter" his fortunes have suffered. The man was mostly "Good Stuff" for the previous 10-15 years before that and his name didn't have all that extra weight. Even when he was EIC at Marvel he wasn't looked at like he is now. I'd just like to see him do consistent work. On just comics and everyone stop scrutinizing so much over him and wish the man would put out just some damn comics that aint associated so much with his disrespected legacy. Just create some good comics again Jim. Geez! The Valiant thing is also just as troubling if not more. It's like a moment in the past that won't "move on". It's like Valiant has to re-achieve the same greatness it had with Pre-Unity Valiant or no one will ever be satisfied again. It's almost like looking at Bryne/Claremont X-Men and being pissed that we can't keep reliving the Dark Phoenix saga. I'm so glad a title like that can move on and look for the next best thing and better days ahead. Valiant just seems so convoluted trying to make it work again. It's so much expectation and Dark Horse is proving to look like a bad host for them to continue on. A year ago, I had high hopes for this relaunch but as mentioned before the marketing was horrendous and so far the output looks disappointing. I feel like I've seen it all before only better and by different companies, titles and characters. I've been feeling this way for a long time now. I'm ready for the NEXT great thing in comics. I just don't think Valiant will ever be it again. They almost seem like they would be better if every Valiant character was a million miles apart from the other and maybe even run by a bunch of different companies. Each existing character owned by a different company. Any chance of them being collected again by one company as a group or minor group obliterated. The collective group has long since grown stale. I honestly like the one issue that VIP did the most of anything since Unity 2000. It looked nothing like we remembered with Valiant. It was at least a FRESH take on them. Almost wish they had won even though I know they wouldn't have worked either. At least it wasn't "Lets recreate the Valiant Bible!!!" Let's stick a fork in this already and find something good that's new. It's about time comics made another classic and leave this long behind. I'm long over Valiant. Hell, I'm enjoying Brightest Day better than this. Sorry to say, there really is better than this out there. I can't tell you the number of people that I've royally pissed off defending Mike Costa and Shane McCarthy, the new writers of IDW's various G1 Transformers series. How I think that Simon Furman, who has written more Transformers than any human being on the planet and apparently can't do no wrong in regards to original TF characters (other versions like Dreamwave's Armada/Energon and IDW's LAM-inspired TF books one can be critical with Furman on but not with the original or G1 versions) and how I think 99% of his IDW run was total crap then being considered something akin to a heretic, who needs to be burned at the stake and a compete and total no good motherfucker who doesn't know what the fuck he's talking about. It's the same with Shooter, not everything he wrote is a classic worthy of praise he has written some really God-awful shitty stories. I'm sorry but Secert Wars (and it's sequel) sucks, it sucked when it came out and it still sucks. If it weren't for because #8 being the debut of Spider-Man's black costume I think nobody would give a flying rat fuck for it.
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Post by bigw1966 on Aug 16, 2010 12:51:27 GMT -5
when Valient first launched, It came at a time when people were looking for a superhero option that wasn't Marvel or DC. Valiant moreso than Dark horse answered that call. Their mix of new characters with old classics had a punch and a nice hook to tie them all together. But, a lot of the failure of Valient does rest on Shooter's shoulders. the mans reputation of having to much hands on control and his my way or the highway attitude caused it to crumble. This is the same issue that has dogged Shooter his entire career. People know this about him and it makes it hard for anyone to want to give him work. If your going to bring Valiant characters back, bring back Eternal Warrior and the Shadowman. those could easily continue at any company. I just cannot find Interest in reading comics about two characters who already had their pinnicles reached almost 20 years ago. Magnus and Solar both reached their logical conclusion. Those stories still stand on their own. there was nothing left to tell. cyberstrike. you can thank Secret Wars for creating the Idea of the huge companywide crossover story event that makes up so much of comics today. That is its legacy far more than the symbiote costume.
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